A few more Mashford loose ends for the mix

Photo: Zeal Monachorum in winter. The home possibly of our earliest Mashford ancestor.

Another researcher has gotten in touch with us in regard to the Mashfords. She thinks her Albert Langmaid Mashford might be a cousin of our Elizabeth.

It is certainly possible and if that is the case then it might open up some new avenues of research for Elizabeth and her family. Albert is also a Devon Mashford but at this stage it all remains possibles or perhaps probables but not absolutes.

I remain curious about the Elizabeth Mashford as illegitimate daughter of a nobleman story - and thus being forced to leave England for Australia. If I have learned anything it is that these oral histories, or stories, are usually true, but not necessarily about the person to whom they are attributed nor to the time-frame suggested. Getting more information about the Devon Mashfords may actually throw enough light on that story to make sense of it and to finally put it to rest.

There are some synchronicities between our family and these Mashfords which may be merely curiosity value or have more substance: both Albert's  father, Robert and Elizabeth's mother, Mary (Cann) were recorded as publicans in census records and Albert, like Elizabeth's brother, Josiah, was in court for insolvency.

Interestingly Albert and his siblings were also literate and while there is some doubt about the level of Elizabeth's literacy, given the illiteracy of my great-grandmother Mary, it seems that her 'siblings' were literate. This discrepancy as I have said before is one thing which makes me wonder if Elizabeth was the daughter of John Mashford and Mary Cann as opposed to a poor cousin, taken in after the death or departure of their daughter Elizabeth.

That however is conjecture. Literacy levels of family members remain in the realm of conjecture given the times but evidence of literacy does confer upon those involved a higher social status than one might otherwise suppose.

Photo: Tavistock Town Hall.

These new Mashfords are from the Tavistock, Stoke Damerel (Plymouth) and Bickleigh areas as opposed to Coldridge from whence our ancestors came. Interestingly though Tavistock is about half-way in a direct line between Coldridge and Plymouth and Bickleigh is between Tavistock and Plymouth.

This reminded me of earlier research into the earliest John Mashford I could find, who was recorded in Zeal Monachorum swearing allegiance to the King, in 1723. Zeal Monachorum is barely four miles from Coldridge which makes him a very likely ancestor for our lot and a possible shared ancestor for Albert's family.

John Mashford of Zeal Monachorum swore his oath nearly one hundred years before Elizabeth was born at The Blue Anchor, Crediton on September 23 before Bampfylde Rodd and John Gibbs esq. There were still some Mashfords in Zeal Monachorum in the 1841 Census.

The records where John Mashford was found are interesting:

Hidden away amongst the mass of documents created by the Devon Quarter Sessions and now held by the Devon Record Office in Exeter is a little known and seldom consulted series of manuscripts compiled in the aftermath of the Jacobite Atterbury plot of 1720-22. 

These 1723 oath rolls contain the names of over 25,000 Devonians, amounting to some one in five of the adult population of the time. They provide the key to unlocking the history of local communities during the early eighteenth century, as the men and women of the county paraded before the Justices of the Peace in order to swear their loyalty to King George I.

 In their original form they are virtually unusable, with the names of individuals listed in no systematic order. Inhabitants of a single parish can appear on numerous separate oath rolls, with many people swearing at towns and villages some miles from their place of residence. The documents are large, cumbersome, and occasionally difficult to read due to centuries of wear and numerous corrections and crossings out. It is for these reasons that they have been selected as the first in a series of documents to be transcribed and published online as part of the Eighteenth Century Devon: People and Communities project.

They will be of use to local researchers, family historians and scholars engaged in the study of eighteenth century Devon society. As the following overview demonstrates they provide insights into levels of literacy, travel and transportation networks, population distribution and the nature of public political engagement. 

This John Mashford may also be a link for another family researcher with whom I was in touch last year, Sandra Robinson and who wrote:

 I too have a connection with the surname of Mashford - my father's maternal grandmother was Catherine Mashford, born 1849 in Newton Ferrers, near Plymouth.  Incidentally that is also where my father was born!  I can only trace my Mashford line back to a marriage of John Mashford at Kenton, near Exeter, in 1752.  I have no leads as to where John was born, although I suspect that it was in the Coldridge (mid Devon) area. 
 

I note that you also show your interest in the surname of Cann and from that I deduce that you descend from the marriage of John Mashford (son of John Mashford and his wife, Mary Labbatt) and Mary Cann. I am aware that several members of the family emigrated to Australia in the 1840's. John's nephew Joseph (only surviving son of John's brother Josiah) also married a Cann, namely Susan. Their daughter Ellen Jane Mashford married 1887 Charles Gove and emigrated to Queensland, Australia.

I had missed the Josiah link when this email arrived more than a year ago but of course it makes sense given the fact that John and Mary named one of their sons Josiah and the fact that Elizabeth's cousin, Ellen Jane Mashford emigrated to Queensland in 1887 may well also be another link given that Albert Langmaid Mashford had emigrated to Australia, eleven years earlier, disembarking in Brisbane in 1866. He soon moved on to New South Wales and eventually to South Australia but if he was a cousin then the Brisbane connection could make more sense than we know.  

Sandra's family actually provides something of a link between our family and Albert's. Kenton, near Exeter, where she found her John Mashford in 1752 is about twenty miles from Zeal Monachorum and a Coldridge origin, as she suggests is certainly likely. In addition, her maternal grandmother and father were born in Newton Ferrers which is barely eight miles from Plymouth and seventeen miles from Bickleigh where Albert Langmaid Mashford's family are found.  Given the travelling times of the 18th and 19th century these three Mashford families are certainly within reach of each other.


 I have written to her again in regard to Albert and sent her this information in the hope that tying a few threads together from a number of families may actually create something of substance in terms of the Devon Mashfords.


There is also the possibility that after living in New South Wales for four years and then in Victoria for about two years, that Albert made the decision to move to South Australia having heard about opportunities at the Wallaroo Mines through South Australian Mashfords. In 1873 when Albert settled in Wallaroo Elizabeth and her husband Edward Atkins, were living in Wirrabarra, admittedly some 145 kilometres to the north, but in the same State and also involved in the mining industry through the Charlton Mine.

Photo: Bickleigh, Devon.

In the meantime, given how often we connect with people through the blog I am going to post some of the information which Albert Langmaid Mashford's researcher has found.

Marriage

Groom's Name:	Robert Mashford
Groom's Birth Date:
Groom's Birthplace:
Groom's Age:
Bride's Name:	Hannah Langmaid
Bride's Birth Date:
Bride's Birthplace:
Bride's Age:
Marriage Date:	16 Sep 1836
Marriage Place:	Stoke Damerel,Devon,England
Groom's Father's Name:
Groom's Mother's Name:
Bride's Father's Name:
Bride's Mother's Name:
Groom's Race:
Groom's Marital Status:
Groom's Previous Wife's Name:
Bride's Race:
Bride's Marital Status:
Bride's Previous Husband's Name:
Indexing Project (Batch) Number:	M05242-1
System Origin:	England-ODM
Source Film Number:	916927
Reference Number:

Photo: Coldridge, Devon.

Newspaper articles- transcripts

Barrier Miner (Broken Hill, NSW : 1888 - 1954) Tuesday 28 June 1892 p 2 Family Notices

MARRIAGE.

MASHFORD-BENNETTS.-June 25. at the Primitive Methodist Manse, Broken Hill, by Rev. Samuel Gray, Albert Reginald, fourth son of Mr. Albert Mashford, of Kadina, to Elizabeth Hannah, eldest daughter of Mr. Richard Bennetts, Of Kadina.    

The South Australian Advertiser (Adelaide, SA : 1858 - 1889) Friday 21 March 1879 p 7 Article

Insolvency Court (listing)

Albert Mashford, of Wallaroo Mines, miner.

South Australian Register (Adelaide, SA : 1839 - 1900) Tuesday 11 March 1879

In re Albert Mashford, of 'Wallaroo Mines, miner; a final hearing. The Accountant's report was as follows: — 'Insolvent only appeared yesterday. The schedule was only filed this morning. Insolvent says that he came to the colony in 1871; that for 1S71 and 1872 he earned £2 per week; for 1873 and 1874 and 1875, 28s. per week; 1878 and 1877. 30s. a week; and for 1877, 1878, and 1879, 35s. per week. Adjourned for a fortnight.

South Australian Register (Adelaide, SA : 1839 - 1900) Wednesday 26 March 1879 Supplement: 

Photo: Wallaroo Mines circa. 1900.

SUPPLEMENT TO THE SOUTH AUSTRALIAN REGISTER p 1 Article

In re Albert Mashford, of Wallaroo Mines, miner; adjourned final hearing. The Accountant reported :— Liabilities, £109 18s. 4d. Assets — Lease of allotment in the Wallaroo Mines township, on which insolvent has built a four roomed pug hut, tank, &c, value doubtful. The insolvent says that he arrived in the early part of August, 1S71, and during 1871 and 1872 earned about £2 a week. During 1S73 and 1874 and 1875 he earned about 2Ss. a week, during 1S76 and 1877 about 30s. a week, and during 1S78 and 1879 about 35s. a week.' Mr. Cherry examined the insolvent, after which he obtained an adjournment for another week. In re Edward Francis Opie, of Aberdeen, mail contractor; adjourned final hearing. Sir. Synson for the insolvent, Mr. A. G. Downer for the assignee. and Mr. Ashton for Mr. William Cockrum. The Accountant reported :—'? Liabilities— Unsecured creditors, £638 18s. 91; secured creditor, Mr. Cockrum. £1,053 18s. Si. =£1,692 17s. 5d. Assets— Seized and sold by Mr. Cockrnm under bill of sale— Coaching horses, £545; farm horses, £100; farm imple ments, £153 ; coach and traps, £140 15s. ; buggy, £20; harness and sundries, £14 14s. 6d=£73 8s. &d. Seized and sold by Mr. Cocburn, but not included in the bill of sale given him— Cattle and pigs, £22 10s.; horses, £100; farm implements and sundries, £93 2a. 6d. ; coaching harness, £9=£224 12s. 6d.=total seizure by Coikrem, £1,198 2s. Twenty-one horses a dray included in bill of sale, £54 5s. ; seven horses, not included, £141 1O3.=£195 15s. Trap at O'Leary's, near Outilpa, included in bill of sale, £20 ; 23 acres at Banbury, purchased, £46 ; estimated value of selection above amount payable to the Goverment, £640 ; claim upon Northern Stage Company, £36 ; property seized by bailiff. £60 18s. Sd; claim upon Liston and Shakes, £18 15s; claim upon Mr. Boase, horse sold, £7 ; book-debts, £152 19s. 7d.=£2,375 10s. 4d. _ Estimated surplus, £632 12s. lid. At the beginning of 1878 the insolvent's coaching plant was valued by Liston & Shakes, and the balance sheet was made out on April 1 on the basis of the valuation, showing a surplus of £1,792 17s. 8d. The subsequent earnings have been.—. From coaches. North-East, £5?$  gj ; Jamestown lme, £204 ; from Northern Stage Company, £12 ; CDS From do., £36 ; carriage of mails orth-E8t, £324; and bonus from J. G. Terry, £'50=jei,S62 6s. Sd. £3,655 4s. 4d; and the expenses: wages, £$23 16s. 2d; forage, £632 16s. lid; sundry expenses, £373 9s. 8d.; interest, £97 3s. 6d.; law coetev, commission, &c, £41 19s. 2d.=£l,669 5s. 5&; Josses on horses dead and a dray, £494 ; on coaches, traps, sc , £467 8s. 9d.=£961 8s. 3d.; living ex penses, £161 17s.; balance of cash cot explained, £381 Oa. 2d.=£2,973 11s. 4d.=£681 13s ; difference in balance, 19s. lid.: estimated surplus, £682 12s. lid. The bill of sale to Mr. Cockrum has not been produced, but insolvent says that it was identical with Liston and Shakes' valuation, and it will be observed that a great deal was sold by Mr. Cockrum which was not in the valuation. The books for the coaching business were regularly kept from April to July 1, 1878.

[full article on file]

The Register (Adelaide, SA : 1901 - 1929) Monday 14 January 1918 p 4 Article

[family notices]

Another pioneer, Mr. Albert Mashford, died at the Wallaroo mines on Tuesday. He was born in Devon, England, in 1842. He and Mrs. Mashford, who predeceased him by six years, came to Australia 52 years ago in the Commodore Perry, and landed at Brisbane, -where he followed the occupation of a miner. Mr. Mashford was similarly engaged in New South Wales and Victoria for seven years, and then settled at the Wallaroo Mines, where he lived for 45 years. Of a family of 10 children, six sons and two daughters are living. There are 20 grandchildren and eight great grand children.

Barrier Miner (Broken Hill, NSW : 1888 - 1954) Tuesday 15 January 1918 p 2 Article

Photo: Wallaroo, South Australia.

Another South Australian pioneer, Mr. Albert Mashford, died at the Wallaroo mines last week (says the "Register"). He was born in Devon, England, in 1842. He and Mrs. Mashford, who predeceased him by six years, came to Australia 52 years ago in the Commodore Perry, and landed at Brisbane: where he followed the occupation of a miner. Mr. Mashford was similarly engaged in New South Wales and Victoria for seven years, and then settled at the Wallaroo mines, where he lived for 45 years. Of a family of 10 children, 8 sons and two daughters are living. There are 20 grandchildren and eight great grandchildren.

The Advertiser (Adelaide, SA : 1931 - 1954) Wednesday 12 August 1942 p 10 Family Notices

MASHFORD (nee Elsie Daddow). —On August 8. at Sister Berry's Private Hospital, to Mr. and Mrs. A. J. Mashford. ot Kadina—a bonny daughter (Margaret Joylene).

Vital Statistics: BDM

(transcripts of BDM records from Ancestry.com)

Birth Record for Ellen Mashford

Name:	Ellen Mashford
Birth Date:	7 Jul 1875
Father's Name:	Albert Langmald Mashford
Mother's name:	Ellen Lukey
Birth Place:	Wallaroo Mines
Registration Place:	Daly, South Australia
Page Number:	195
Volume Number:	154

Death Record for Albert Mashford

Name:	Alfred John Langmead Mashford
Death Place:	South Australia
Registration Year:	1926-1930
Registration Place:	South Australia
Page Number:	225
Volume Number:	491

Photo: Moonta Railway Station, South Australia.

Marriage Record for John Mashford (Albert’s brother)

Name:	John Lukey Mashford
Father's Name:	Albert Langmaid Mashford
Spouse Name:	Lily Olds
Spouse's Father's Name:	William Henry Olds
Marriage Date:	7 Sep 1907
Marriage Place:	Moonta Mines
Registration Place:	Daly, South Australia
Page Number:	1231
Volume Number:	232

Marriage Record for John Mashford (unknown connection?)

Name:	John Mashford
Spouse Name:	Susanna Heanes
Marriage Date:	4 Oct 1847
Marriage Place:	Adelaide
Registration Place:	Adelaide, South Australia
Page Number:	103
Volume Number:	2

Marriage for Alfred John Mashford

Name:	Alfred John Mashford
Father's Name:	Albert Mashford
Spouse Name:	Mary Jane Veal
Spouse's Father's Name:	Edmund Veal
Marriage Date:	13 Aug 1885
Marriage Place:	Kadina
Registration Place:	Daly, South Australia
Page Number:	546
Volume Number:	144

Death Record for Hannah Mashford

Name:	Ellen Mashford
Death Date:	19 Mar 1912
Death Place:	Wallaroo Mines
Age:	68
Residence Place:	Wallaroo Mines
Registration Place:	Daly, South Australia
Page Number:	35
Volume Number:	364
Estimated Birth Year:	abt 1844

Birth Record for Frederick John Mashford

Name:	Frederick John Mashford
Birth Date:	23 Dec 1870
Father's Name:	Robert John Langmald Mashford
Mother's name:	Annie Wearne
Birth Place:	Wallaroo Mines
Registration Place:	Daly, South Australia
Page Number:	430
Volume Number:	90

Birth Record for Ernest Mashford

Name:	Ernest Mashford
Birth Date:	12 Sep 1877
Father's Name:	Albert Mashford
Mother's name:	Ellen Lukey
Birth Place:	Wallaroo Mines
Registration Place:	Daly, South Australia
Page Number:	187
Volume Number:	190

Birth summaries

Name Year Parents Place

Albert Reginald Mashford	1871	Albert, Ellen	Clunes, Victoria
Robert Mashford	1873	Albert, Ellen	Wallaroo Mines, South Australia
Ernest Mashford	1877	Albert, Ellen	Wallaroo Mines, South Australia
Walter Mashford	1880	Albert, Ellen	Wallaroo Mines, South Australia

The long shot which was way too long it seems

It was a long shot but too long it seems, for the Port Pirie researcher says the Charles Stuart Ross I thought might have been a missing child of our Charlie,was actually a baby who died at 22 months, not 22 years, his parents are clearly listed and  his father was Alexander Ross.

As the email states:

Sorry to disappoint you on the thought of Charles being married twice. I can only find the one marriage on record and the person below was born to Alexander Ross and Philis Mudie in Pt. Pirie. Alexander and Philis had several other children besides Charles Stuart and unfortunately did have some bad luck with children surviving at that time. Alexander and Philis married in Adelaide and had their first child also called Charles in Adelaide. The first child lived 2weeks. Charles Stuart was in actual fact only 22mths old when he died, not 22yrs as you have quoted below. The council is going through old records and at times they are a little hard to decipher so I can understand that it would be easy to get it mixed up with yrs and mths if the record just shows 22 recorded. This is why we go to the death records to confirm the age at death which shows him as being 1yr and 10mths old.

I am having a little trouble finding any records of Charles Ross in Pt. Pirie. I have yet to go through the old Recorders but not having an exact year this might be a long drawn out exercise. We have been through some of the old Advertisers and as yet have not found his name among those that have jumped ship. Pity we do not know his Uncles name or the name of the ship he may have been on.

This is not to say that Charles Ross was not married more than once and there is not a first wife from Port Pirie or even children but just to say these children are definitely not his.One would have thought an earlier marriage would be found and if no such record exists it suggests our Charlie was a somewhat exceptional man remaining single for so long. Or perhaps just a poor one, money being the crucial ingredient at the time, if one were to wed.

Then again, perhaps he had a family back on Ithaca and was sending money home. If something happened to that family in the mid 1880's it might push him to find another wife and to irrevocably commit to Australia as home.

The Port Pirie researcher is finding it tough going to track anything down which might relate to our Charles Ross but I shan't give up hope yet. Another long-shot thought dropped into my mind today and that was, given the independence of thought seen in many of Charlie's descendants and noticing an image of the Freemason's from Port Pirie, I am wondering if it is worth checking any connection with that organisation. I have sent a note to the researcher to that end.

I am thinking if nothing comes of this then the next step is to settle myself in the South Australian State Library for the time it takes to go through copies of the Areas Express and look for other stories about Charlie.

From the tone of his obituary I would hazard a guess that he had been written about previously and his roving career detailed in a general article on a local personality. He was well liked by many and it sounds as if he had an interesting life before moving to Gladstone - more than enough to whet the interest of any journalist on a quiet day.

Time will tell.

Was Charlie Ross also married more than once?

While waiting for researchers to get back to me I have been doing some more pondering on ways to 'find' Charlie Ross.

The newspaper article provided valuable information in that it gave a 'date' for his arrival in Gladstone and the information that prior to that he had been settled in Port Pirie. The word 'settled' implies that he had been there for some years.

Looking at his age when he married Mary Atkins there is a good chance that a man of thirty-nine in that day and age may well have been married before. I had considered the possibility that he had left a wife and family behind on Ithaca but I doubt that given the reference to his 'roving career' and the fact that boys joined ship as young as eleven and probably no later than fifteen. I am taking the middle position and guessing he set sail 'on his uncle's ship', as the family story goes, around the age of thirteen. This means he could have had a roving career of some seven to ten years and arrived in Port Pirie at the age of twenty or so.

This would have given him around fifteen or more years in the town where it seems highly unlikely that he would remain unmarried. It seemed to me a search of cemetery records might be the way to go and there I found a Charles Stuart Ross who could possibly be a son. I have passed the information on to the Port Pirie researcher on the basis that it is well worth checking out.

ROSS, CHARLES STUART

Surname	ROSS
Given Names	CHARLES STUART
Cemetery	PORT PIRIE
Section	COMMON PROTESTANT 1
Plot/Grave/Niche	40
Last Residence	PORT PIRIE
Age at Death	22 YRS
Date of Burial	29/09/1892
Minister Officiating	REV. CHAPMAN
Burial/Order Number	709

Comments

CP ,LOT 40, GRAVE:6

Photo: Port Pirie smelters circa 1907... the year Charlie Ross died.

Charles Stuart Ross would have been sixteen or seventeen when our Charlie Ross went to Gladstone - more than old enough to be working and to remain behind. As to what happened to a first wife, I would guess that she died although I have found no records for a suitable 'fit.' She may not have of course, women left their marriages in the same way that men did - not as often, but it did happen.

Her death is a more likely explanation given that Charlie Ross would have made regular trips to Port Pirie to source his fish for the Gladstone trade and a 'living wife' would be rather too inconvenient. If this Charles Ross were found to be his son, the lack of family knowledge could be easily explained by the fact that Charlie and Mary's children were toddlers when he died - the couple having been married barely four years when Charles Stuart Ross died in Port Pirie.

A marriage certificate for Charles Ross, with the same details, perhaps even with a place of birth or Greek surname, found in Port Pirie would be a huge step forward. I can only hope.

There is another possible Ross child buried in Port Pirie:

ROSS, FRANCES MAY

Surname	ROSS
Given Names	FRANCES MAY
Cemetery	PORT PIRIE
Section	COMMON PROTESTANT 1
Plot/Grave/Niche	74
Last Residence	PORT PIRIE
Age at Death	11YRS
Date of Burial	07/12/1897
Minister Officiating	SALVATION ARMY CAPTAIN
Funeral Director	SYMONDS
Burial/Order Number	1167

Comments

CP ,LOT 74, GRAVE:3

Photo: Port Pirie Cemetery.

It is a long shot but the fact that she would have been one the year Charlie went to Gladstone could also serve as an explanation for his departure - the death of his wife. Given the times it is more likely that the child would have been handed over to grandparents or other member's of his dead wife's family. And given that she also died while Charlie and Mary's children were still very young, serves as an explanation for a lack of family knowledge should she indeed be found to be a child of his first marriage.

As things now stand I may not need to get to Ithaca to find out his Greek name and place of birth although it remains a long shot - however, it is a shot and it may well bring results.

I have also decided that Ithaca is the most likely place of his birth out of the two possibles - Ithaca and Kythera. Both sound phonetically similar and there is a large Kytheran community in Port Pirie so I had wondered if this was his birthplace. However, having been in touch with the Kytheran community seeking for possible name fits, given that we know, from the signature on his marriage certificate that his Greek name began ROS, it looks like Ithaca and Rossolimos remain the best bets.

The two Kytheran names which were suggested were RAISIS and ROUSSOS but it is absolutely clear that neither of these fit the ROS which we know began his Greek name given his mistake in signing and the corrections made.

It is not much progress but it is progress.

Luke has also been busy and has come up with the following information:

I wrote a letter to the Yass & District Historical Society about 3 weeks ago and received a reply from them a few days ago. No real news on Edward Atkins, but I will report what they told me. They have access to Ancestry.com so there is no point repeating what they got from Ancestry, but they have access to records not available to us like the Yass Bench Books 1834-1837.  They have no records for Edwin/Edward Atkins except he was assigned to Henry O'Brien. His brother was Cornelius O'Brien and they shared their assigned convicts between them. They said if a convict kept a low profile then there would be no records which suggest that Edward Atkins behaved himself.

There is a record for a Charles Atkins aged 21 arrived on the ship called the Heron in 1833 and tried in Essex. He was assigned to Cornelius O'Brien and is recorded in the bench book in 1836 for disobedience and neglect of duty. I notice that the report from England that Edward had a brother called Charles Atkins. Could this be the same person? I know there is no way to prove it or not. It may be a relation of Edward if we can find out where he was born. I have not done any research on Ancestry.com on this Charles Atkins who was a convict as yet, but I think it worth a try.

The only other thing is that Henry and Cornelius O'Brien were Magistrates in the Yass area for many years along witth a person called William Hampton Dutton. W.H Dutton went to South Australia via Victoria in 1839 because there was a severe drought in the Yass area. They state in the letter:-" It is possible that your Edward went to South Australia at the same time. It is not implausible that Dutton may have encouraged Edward who had a clean record with no infringements to go to S.A with him. W.H. Dutton was instrumental in establishment of Hahndorf South Australia."


This is certainly a possibility although we still have the E.Atkins recorded on the same ship which brought his first wife Hannah McLeod to Australia. However, this does not mean that the Dutton connection does not work. Edward may well have returned to England after he completed his sentence, as the UK researcher suggests and made the decision to go to South Australia instead of returning to New South Wales, because of guidance from William Dutton.

Charles Atkins was born in 1810 according to the researcher's report, which would make him 23 in 1833, however, ages and dates of birth are often wrong. It is certainly possible that he could be this Edward (Edwin) Atkins's older brother.

At this stage we are strong on conjecture and weak on facts but we have been here before and more than once has intuition and conjecture been ultimately validated. Here's hoping it will be again. A first marriage for Charlie in Port Pirie could provide a wealth of facts - not to mention a horde of relations!

At the turn of the century there were fifty Greeks in south Australia and 1,000 as a whole. Most worked as mariners or wharf labourers and only four or five were recorded as having shops – mostly fish shops. You would not think it would be too difficult to find out more about Charlie if he was one of only fifty in South Australia and one of only half a dozen who owned a shop? Of course he may not have owned a shop and may simply have had a cart and worked out of home.

Photo: Ithaca in the 18th century.

And it seems Ithaca was one place from which these earliest Greek settlers in Port Pirie came. Hugh Gilchrist, a former ambassador to Greece wrote a series of books titled Australians and Greeks where apparently the most information that one can get on the earliest days of Greeks in the country can be had. I have ordered the book, hoping, but not expecting that Charlie Ross, alias Carolus Rossolimos might get a mention.

As far as SA naturalisation records show the earliest Greek in Port Pirie was Peter Warrick, the surname being seriously anglicized. He was naturalised in 1892 when he was working as a carpenter in the town. His birthplace was Kalamata, Peloponnese. It would have been so convenient if Charlie has become naturalised but there is no evidence that he ever did and so no information. Then again, if he really did jump ship and was listed as a deserter somewhere - not that I have found that either - then he would keep a low profile.

If we can find the necessary evidence it would make Charlie one of South Australia's earliest Greek settlers and Port Pirie's first!

The hooks are thrown just waiting for a catch to pull in

This is another of those waiting times. I have thrown out some research lines and now must wait for a catch to appear.

A researcher in Port Pirie is working on Charlie Ross's time there and although the chances are slim of anything coming up it remains possible. How wonderful to find a record of a Greek fishmonger with his Greek name registered along with his place of birth? I would be over the moon. It would also be wonderful synchronicity given that Pirie is one of my former homes.

I also have a researcher working on the Atkins/Haynes families in Gloucestershire which might throw light on my great-great-grandfather's ancestry. Here's hoping that we get to know more about the origins of Edward Atkins.

But I have to say, if I had a wish list and could only have one result it would be for my great-grandfather Charlie Ross. Was his name Rossolimos or something else? Was he born on Ithaca or Kythera or somewhere else? What was his Greek name?

It's waiting time with fingers crossed.

The convict factor is raised again for Edward Atkins

Photo: The convict ship Florentia made two voyages to Sydney - in 1827 and 1830.


Following a report from the UK researcher who has been looking into Edward Atkins, we are once again considering the possibility that he first came to Australia as a convict.

This was raised some time ago when an Edward/Edwin Atkins was found in a New South Wales convict Muster and later recorded as working at Yas Plains.

Edward Atkins    1830  Florentia    (on convict muster record but not transcribed to ship record)  24 yo Gloucester

compared to

Edwin Atkins      1830  Florentia  (transcribed to ship record)  19 yo  from Yas Plains.

But Kylie's research makes it unlikely there are two people involved. She said: 

Photo: Shepherd's hut in mid 19th century.

One reason I think there is only one person here is that there are no conflicting records, no conviction for Edward Atkins, no ship record etc, and there is no Edwin Atkins in the 1837 muster.  If you check the muster record the ancestry.com year of birth is worked off the arrival date not the current year.  I think the age is the current age, 24 (and he should have been at least 25 if he was 19 in 1830), take that from 1837, not 1830 and you end up with a close enough year of birth to be the same person.  It is also possible that this is our Edward, and that he started out as Edwin.  Interestingly the comment I have for Yas Plains in 1835 is that there is only a few scoundrelly convict shepherds there.

Yas or Yass Plains is just inside the NSW/South Australian border, some 300 kilometres from Gladstone and this Edwin/Edward was not only a blacksmith but was transported for stealing a sheep. Our Edward was a blacksmith and later worked as a shepherd. 

The O'Brien brothers, Cornelius and Henry, from County Mayo, Ireland, settled this area in 1833 and employed Edwin/Edward Atkins and other 'scoundrelly' convict shepherds.

 Photo: Edward Atkins circa: 1870 with Mary (left) and Elizabeth.

The Certificate of Freedom report on Edwin/Edward Atkins says he  had dark grey eyes, sandy hair, a ruddy-freckled complexion, eyebrows meeting and he was 5ft. 71/2 inches and had a tattoo HEA on his right inside wrist. The photo of our Edward clearly shows the fair and possibly ruddy and freckled complexion and the sandy hair and dark eyes and the height looks right when compared to the height of his eldest daughter Elizabeth who is standing beside him.


All in all it is quite a good 'fit.' And then we have the report from the UK researcher: 

Here are my findings upon my recent research into your family of Atkins.  As I originally posited, and as I believe you yourself in your several blogs, the Atkins and their connections stem in all likelihood from Gloucestershire.  Please find below my initial findings after reviewing the information you have kindly supplied on your Atkins family. 

Your ancestor Edward Atkins, as you have discovered, married twice in Australia.  Firstly, to Hannah McLeod in 1843 and secondly, to Elizabeth Lewis nee Mashford in 1857.  You state that at present you state that you have found no death notice, as yet, for Hannah Atkins sometime between 1854 and 1857 – she could have perhaps have returned to Britain on a visit and if so, could have died there, although I have not been able to find a suitable death entry, or perhaps she was registered as having died say in Australia but no notice was put in the paper.  I presume that you have located her death entry in the Vital Records?

Edward Atkins death notice is intriguing and provides some clues as to possible avenues of research.  All told, from both marriages, Edward had three sons and six daughters.  The death notice states that he had one son and five daughters, so this suggests that two of his sons were dead (Joseph died as an infant in 1855), and, that one of the daughters had died by 1891.  The most interesting ‘clue’ is the final sentence ‘Gloucestershire Papers please copy’, that surely indicates that Edward has originally hailed from Gloucestershire, or at least had family living there.

You supplied a possible marriage of a Joseph Atkins and an Ann Haines in Cirencester in Gloucestershire in 1809.  I have also discovered this marriage. From the two marriage certificates of Edward, that you kindly copied to me, states that Edward’s father was called Joseph. This, and the Hai(y)nes connection makes for a strong possibility that this couple were the parents of your Edward. 

To try and prove, or disprove, this theory I have done some initial research which will have to be evidentially proved by searches in the relevant parish registers at the Gloucestershire Record Office, if you think this appropriate, or I can see if there are any printed transcripts for the relevant parishes.  My findings and suggestions for further research are stated below:

Joseph Atkins married Ann Haines in 14 August 1809 in Cirencester in the county of Gloucestershire.  By looking at online sources and indexes I have been able to trace the following children born to this couple.  As stated above, in order to prove the veracity of this information original or transcripts of the parish registers will need to be consulted, as in many cases intimation as to witnesses at marriages and occupations of bridegroom can be included in original registers where it can be missing in transcripts.

All the children were baptised in Cirencester, Gloucestershire:

Charles Atkins bp. 1 July 1810

Henry Edwin Atkins bp. 23 February 1812

Joseph Lewis Atkins b. 18 January 1814, bp. 13 February 1814, bur. 3 April 1814

James Webb Atkins b. 14 August 1816, bp. 5 October 1816

Susannah b. 30 November 1817, bp. 3 January 1819

David Atkins b. 31 March 1822, bp. 19 May 1822

Thomas Haines Atkins b. 20 June 1825, bp. 24 July 1825, d. 30 October 1825

Mary Ann Haines Atkins b. 10 January 1827, bp. 4 February 1827

Upon searching the 1841 census for England, I located the following sibling:

James W. Atkins and his wife Jane, and son George aged 1 were living in Cheltenham.

Figure 1 - James Atkins, 1841 Census of St Mary, Cheltenham

There was no sign of Joseph and Ann, the parents, nor any other of the children.

I have however found possible deaths for Joseph in Cheltenham in 1860 and Ann in Cheltenham in 1865, both aged 74, which would give a year of birth c. 1791 which is not too far from their suggested birth dates of 1788 and 1789 respectively.

In Slater’s Directory of 1850, under Cirencester, I found one entry that may be of interest – Payne & Atkins, of Castle Street, who were listed as milliners and straw bonnet makers.  This may be a female enterprise, perhaps one of the sisters listed above in partnership with another person?

Subsequent censuses revealed George Atkins and David Atkins with their spouses, but not ‘Edward’ Atkins at all, which seems to suggest that he was elsewhere.

Figure 2 - David Atkins, 1851 Census of Cheltenham

Figure 3 - George Atkins, 1861 Census of Lutterworth, Leicestershire

Figure 4 - David Atkins, 1861 Census of Stroud, Gloucestershire

Figure 5 - David Atkins, 1871 Census, Stroud, Gloucestershire

                                                                                                                                              

I have found that a David Atkins married a Hannah Holder in Cheltenham, during the September quarter of 1842, which seems to tally with the above.

I would like to suggest that the Henry Edwin Atkins listed above is in fact your Edward Atkins.  The reasons being that from the information that you have supplied, and by looking at various lists of people travelling to and from Britain and Australia, I believe that your ancestor first set foot in Australia as a nineteen year old convict, Edwin Atkins, sentenced to 7 years, this being in 1830. 

Convict Registers

Edwin Atkins              Gloucester Assizes      7 April 1830    7 years                        

Convict & Passenger Records

Edwin Atkins    19      Florentia          1830    7 yrs  Protestant          Hy O’Brien  ‘Yes Plains’

NSW Muster Rolls

Edward Atkins           20        Florentia          1830                Gloucester

Therefore, by his first marriage in 1843, on a return to Australia, he would have served his sentence and returned to England c. 1837/40.  The economic climate at home may have prompted a move back to Australia and its possibilities for settlement and employment.  This is of course only a theory that will need to be substantiated one way or another.  To this end I have located an entry in the Convict Registers for an Edwin Atkins (see fig. 1) sentenced as mentioned above, for 7 years transportation.  I feel it would be beneficial to see if the case is entered in the Gloucester Assize Records as the birth date and county of origin tally with the man who was born in Cirencester.  On his return to Australia, ‘Edward’ Atkins may well have felt a slight change to his name was advisable?  It is interesting to note that his eldest son was called Henry, his second Joseph and the third has the Haynes name included.

Further research in the Cirencester family also found possible further siblings for Joseph Atkins, who was baptised 22 June 1788 in Cirencester:

Mary Ann Atkins b. 26 June 1795

Thomas Howell Atkins bp. 26 June 1796, d. 28 August 1797

Thomas Atkins bp. 1 July 1798

All born in Cirencester, whose father was stated as being a Thomas Atkins.

I have also found a marriage between a Thomas Atkins and a Grace Boulton on 3 June 1778 in Cirencester who could well prove to be the parents of these children.  As before, a search in the parish registers would be beneficial.

Please let me know if you would like me to put in hand the further research suggested.  A search in the local newspapers in the Gloucestershire area may  prove beneficial as would a systematic search in the parish registers of Cirencester and Cheltenham as well as a search in the judicial records to prove that Edward / Edwin Atkins who was sent to Australia is the same chap who was baptised in Cirencester in 1812.

If our Edward is Henry Edwin Atkins it would also make sense why his first-born son was called Henry Edward. His second son with Hannah got the name of Joseph, his father's name and his third son, with Elizabeth was called James which was the name of H.E. Atkins's brother.


Two of his siblings also carry the name Haines(Haynes) as does Edward's third son and perhaps by this time he was prepared to give the name Haynes to one of his children - or, given that we don't have a middle name for Joseph, it was a name already bequeathed without our knowing.

The next step in the process is for the UK researcher to do the work required to prove that this Henry Edwin Atkins is the convict who came to Australia on the Forentia in 1830 at the age of nineteen. If it is then it is highly likely he is also our Edward because he would have had enough time to return to England in 1837 before re-appearing in South Australia in 1840 on the same ship with Hannah McLeod.